I remain friends with many people with whom I disagree strongly when it comes to politics and the covid vaccines, but we don't make it personal and so remain friends. I have a cousin through marriage who goes into rages at the mere mention of Trump or the suggestion that covid vaccines are not particularly effective and should be a matter of choice. We cannot discuss any matter on which we disagree because he says things like, "Anybody who likes Trump or who believes Covid vaccines should be a matter of choice is an idiot." To people like that, an opinion that differs from theirs is intolerable. My wife and I get along quite well, yet cancel each other's vote at every election. We laugh about our differences, because it is what is in the heart that matters and how you treat each other. The rest is simply opinion, and who really cares?
I want to be friends with you and your wife, Steve S! I think that's the key: Don't make it personal. And don't take things personally. It is simply opinion and who really cares? What matters, as you say so eloquently, as that we treat each other with kindness and respect and try out best to make the world a gentler place. Mocking people for their religious views (as many atheists do) does not result in anything but hurt. Similarly, telling people their children and they themselves will go to hell because they have not been baptized (as I've been told) is not in the spirit of kindness and does not make the human experience any less fraught. Sorry to go on for so long. Your comment really speaks to me.
"Anybody who likes Trump or who believes Covid vaccines should be a matter of choice is an idiot."
Are we cousins, perchance? I have a BIL who might have said this. My partner and I agree on virtually all political/health politics issues but our respective sisters give us the silent treatment, rather than discuss and disagree. It wasn't always like that, pre-2019.
Maybe, but not by blood. My cousin through marriage is otherwise a good guy, but at the mention of Trump or mention of covid he loses all perspective and can't separate the person from the opinion. No doubt many of us have family members or friends that are like that, incapable of having a civil difference of opinion on certain topics.
If I eat a garlic, am I a garlic? Today I ordered blue cheese with my eggs a la Mexicana. My friend said it would make me stink. I shrugged. She said I have to eat blue cheese with bread and wine. Ok, I said. When?
> or can you be friends with people whose opinions differ from yours?
REPLY: Depends on how you identify friends. For sure we can work with people who disagree with us. That is a solid gold foundation in the corporate world. The work force of any conglomerate is a many splendid place full of different people.
But there are folks that see your life as not worth the toilet paper you may use. I can have compassion for them. But I will be on my guard as best I can as I would like to stay around a while.
So can I be friends with a corporate polluter that says it isn't profitable to recycle or capture and sequester toxins. For example Fukushima or East Palestine Ohio where environmental agencies have told us all is well. And any other way to handle to toxic pollution is prohibitively expensive.
Can I be friends with folks who feel peoples lives are not worth the extra cost to do it right? I will need to think about that for a while. Again how do you define friendship.
Hey there William, I think I agree with you--why would anyone even WANT to be friends with someone who negates them or sees their life as worthless? That's what makes me sad about all the judgement I see (mostly coming from liberals and the people who take pride in thinking of themselves as "open-minded" and "forward-thinking" while they cancel anyone who does not agree with them to the letter about X or Y topic. Perhaps I am being judgmental here too. But, as I said in my comment to Steve S. above, what matters most is how you treat people, if you show up when you are needed, if you are a love-forward person or an a-hole. I am trying very hard to be one of the good guys, which also means having compassion for those who are so hurt (by my opinions, by Trump, by perceived slights) that they act with unkindness or even violence towards others. But, like you, I don't have any reason to be "friends" with people who perpetuate suffering. Not sure if these thoughts make any sense. If you made it this far, thanks for reading. 😉
I agree. You nailed with < what matters most is how you treat people, if you show up when you are needed, if you are a love-forward person >
And we need to take care ( I mean be caring) as with a child. Those you feel we are useless eater etc. They cannot be left alone with the levers that lead to the future. The will badly hurt themselves and others. They need serious care. They cannot be allowed to play with matches, so to speak.
How well you have treated this sad situation - I have experienced it myself. My heart goes out to your daughter - even more than to you. A parent's pain - the children's loss. It happens all too often as we watch and suffer from the treatment that no parent deserves knowing that the children's regret will never go away once there is an awakening of how there was always a better and even rewarding way to learn the lesson of the effort of honest discourse. As for the friends lost from the health discourse - perhaps their fear is that the truth might be something they cannot face. Thank you, once again.
I remain friends with many people with whom I disagree strongly when it comes to politics and the covid vaccines, but we don't make it personal and so remain friends. I have a cousin through marriage who goes into rages at the mere mention of Trump or the suggestion that covid vaccines are not particularly effective and should be a matter of choice. We cannot discuss any matter on which we disagree because he says things like, "Anybody who likes Trump or who believes Covid vaccines should be a matter of choice is an idiot." To people like that, an opinion that differs from theirs is intolerable. My wife and I get along quite well, yet cancel each other's vote at every election. We laugh about our differences, because it is what is in the heart that matters and how you treat each other. The rest is simply opinion, and who really cares?
I want to be friends with you and your wife, Steve S! I think that's the key: Don't make it personal. And don't take things personally. It is simply opinion and who really cares? What matters, as you say so eloquently, as that we treat each other with kindness and respect and try out best to make the world a gentler place. Mocking people for their religious views (as many atheists do) does not result in anything but hurt. Similarly, telling people their children and they themselves will go to hell because they have not been baptized (as I've been told) is not in the spirit of kindness and does not make the human experience any less fraught. Sorry to go on for so long. Your comment really speaks to me.
Absolutely! Appreciate your kind words.
"Anybody who likes Trump or who believes Covid vaccines should be a matter of choice is an idiot."
Are we cousins, perchance? I have a BIL who might have said this. My partner and I agree on virtually all political/health politics issues but our respective sisters give us the silent treatment, rather than discuss and disagree. It wasn't always like that, pre-2019.
Maybe, but not by blood. My cousin through marriage is otherwise a good guy, but at the mention of Trump or mention of covid he loses all perspective and can't separate the person from the opinion. No doubt many of us have family members or friends that are like that, incapable of having a civil difference of opinion on certain topics.
If I eat a garlic, am I a garlic? Today I ordered blue cheese with my eggs a la Mexicana. My friend said it would make me stink. I shrugged. She said I have to eat blue cheese with bread and wine. Ok, I said. When?
Merry Mary, this comment made me laugh out loud. 🙏
Blue cheese in quesadillas? Chef's kiss...
> or can you be friends with people whose opinions differ from yours?
REPLY: Depends on how you identify friends. For sure we can work with people who disagree with us. That is a solid gold foundation in the corporate world. The work force of any conglomerate is a many splendid place full of different people.
But there are folks that see your life as not worth the toilet paper you may use. I can have compassion for them. But I will be on my guard as best I can as I would like to stay around a while.
So can I be friends with a corporate polluter that says it isn't profitable to recycle or capture and sequester toxins. For example Fukushima or East Palestine Ohio where environmental agencies have told us all is well. And any other way to handle to toxic pollution is prohibitively expensive.
Can I be friends with folks who feel peoples lives are not worth the extra cost to do it right? I will need to think about that for a while. Again how do you define friendship.
Hey there William, I think I agree with you--why would anyone even WANT to be friends with someone who negates them or sees their life as worthless? That's what makes me sad about all the judgement I see (mostly coming from liberals and the people who take pride in thinking of themselves as "open-minded" and "forward-thinking" while they cancel anyone who does not agree with them to the letter about X or Y topic. Perhaps I am being judgmental here too. But, as I said in my comment to Steve S. above, what matters most is how you treat people, if you show up when you are needed, if you are a love-forward person or an a-hole. I am trying very hard to be one of the good guys, which also means having compassion for those who are so hurt (by my opinions, by Trump, by perceived slights) that they act with unkindness or even violence towards others. But, like you, I don't have any reason to be "friends" with people who perpetuate suffering. Not sure if these thoughts make any sense. If you made it this far, thanks for reading. 😉
I agree. You nailed with < what matters most is how you treat people, if you show up when you are needed, if you are a love-forward person >
And we need to take care ( I mean be caring) as with a child. Those you feel we are useless eater etc. They cannot be left alone with the levers that lead to the future. The will badly hurt themselves and others. They need serious care. They cannot be allowed to play with matches, so to speak.
So I share your heart and insight. _/\_
How well you have treated this sad situation - I have experienced it myself. My heart goes out to your daughter - even more than to you. A parent's pain - the children's loss. It happens all too often as we watch and suffer from the treatment that no parent deserves knowing that the children's regret will never go away once there is an awakening of how there was always a better and even rewarding way to learn the lesson of the effort of honest discourse. As for the friends lost from the health discourse - perhaps their fear is that the truth might be something they cannot face. Thank you, once again.
❤️
🙏